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Thursday, March 22, 2007

Bold Move Helps RVer Get Action From RV Manufacturer

Dennis Abbott and his wife have been full time RVers for 13 years this July. Typical of many owners of new motor coaches, Dennis was having more difficulty than a half million dollar coach ought to have. He told me so many problems he’s had with this coach that it would take five articles to cover them all.

Suffice it to say, Dennis couldn’t get the multitude of manufacturer defects fixed in a timely manner and his out of pocket expenses for repairs under a supposed warranty were keeping him awake at night. This Texan made a bold move, took out his paint brush and went the first amendment route. I like his style and being parked at the FMCA campground finally garnered the attention of his manufacturer. He told me that corporate promised to get it all repaired at no cost to him, but he isn’t holding his breath. We’ll see how it all comes out.

So here is the burning question, why should a customer who pays a king’s ransom for a new motor coach have to resort to this anyway? Why can’t RV manufacturers make a consistently good quality product right off the assembly line? Leave a comment and tell me what you think about this issue. Jim

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posted by Jim Twamley at 3/22/2007 07:10:00 PM

76 Comments:

  • Boy, have I heard this story too many times. When we bought our current coach, we did tons of research and decided on a Lazy Daze Class C just for this reason, after sale customer service. After 18 months we are still completely pleased and talk with many Lazy Daze owners who agree that the after sale customer service at Lazy Daze (Montclair, California) is exceptional in this day and age.

    Kate

    http://cholulared.blogspot.com
    &
    http://www.cholulared.com

    By Blogger Kate & Terry, at March 22, 2007 7:53:00 AM PDT  

  • I agree except that it doesn't have to be an expensive motorhome. For those of us that buy new Truck Campers and Trailers warranty work and the attitude for the manufacturers is just as important. I'm afraid that the entire RV Industry is suffering from lack of good customer care.

    By Blogger Sydeny, at March 22, 2007 8:53:00 AM PDT  

  • This gentleman's experiences, which have been recounted to us by a number of new coach purchasers from various manufacturers is why we have chosen not to buy a new unit. The published warranties RV manufacturers present are not worth the paper that they are printed on, nor does their management stand tall in the face of expensive warranty claims. If the industry is not careful, they too will succumb to Chinese and Japanese competition!

    By Anonymous WanderlodgePurchaser@yahoo.com, at March 23, 2007 6:29:00 PM PDT  

  • I think we're going to see a sea change in the RV industry over the next 5-10 years as the poor manufacturers get exposed by this new phenomonen taking over everything - the internet.

    I can't imagine anyone investing in a new RV nowadays without doing a full investigation on the net.

    Monaco probably realized that not only the hundred or so RV's at the rally saw Dennis's sign, but THOUSANDS more will see it for months to come.

    By Anonymous Fred Wishnie, at March 24, 2007 8:11:00 AM PDT  

  • As an 05 Monaco owner this situation with Dennis Abbott and his wife has hit a nerve. I'm sure there are other RV owners with other makes who are also affected by this too.

    I spent the entire first year in and out of the shop with warranty work thus preventing any meaningful travel. That's OK, however now that the quick 1 year warranty is over, more and more non-covered extended warranty issues are mounting. I have been disabled for the last 30 years and don't have the means to correct these issues.

    I love the RV life and want to continue with it but when you get better warranty service from the manufacture of your toaster than from an RV costing tens of thousands more, a big question mark arises. This is not right! I applaud and agree with Mr. Abbott for his actions.

    By Anonymous Don L., at March 25, 2007 6:59:00 AM PDT  

  • As an RV Service Manager I see both sides, the largest problem is that parts are just not made available. There are brands who do make parts available in a timely manner but they cost about 10% more. Not just the cost of the part, the cost of the entire RV.

    People choose often on price, and do not check out the line they are buying. I understand that a half million dollars is not a small sum, but five hundred fifty thousand would get a winnebego who has parts abailable. Winnebego also is interested in getting people back on the road.

    Most manufacturers will only do what they have to to make the largest profit. They will tell the servicing dealer no, no, no. but some times when the customer calls they will say, " we have no idea why the dealer would not do this?" "we will help" and to top that they will then deny the warranty claim to the dealer.

    Being a fleetwood dealer I can say since they are in trouble financially, they have become the worst in the business. We have 11 more manufactures in stock, most are getting more customer friendly, fleetwood is getting far worse. We dropped Monaco for not paying their warranty claims, they are one who has the price built in for better customer service but have made that a profit area also.

    Good luck to trailer buyers in the future. I see the RVDA and RVIA trying to help and they have excellent ideas, the "however" is the manufacturers will not add the cost until someone else does. So her is the satnd-off.

    I know I sound a little jaded on this issue.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 27, 2007 10:55:00 AM PDT  

  • We are all quick to point out a manufacturer that does poorly, but Jayco deserves credit for standing behind their product with a two year warranty and the best customer service and parts people in the business. This RV dealer can lay down and sleep at night because I sell a good product. We have sold other brands and, believe me, there is a difference!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 29, 2007 7:03:00 AM PDT  

  • The past year I purchased the top of the line Sunnybrook Toyhauler. Should say after referring to many articles and sites prior to my purchase I made a huge mistake.

    As a disabled veteran I needed a 5th wheel that needed minimal service. Well, after many days at various dealers and a trip to the factory I am stuck with a RV that is substandard at best. On the surface the manufacture makes the unit look good, but the lack of quality by Sunnybrook is apparent everywhere I turn. Too many to list here!

    The president of Sunnybrook even had this insulting remark that I can only paraphrase. It's the consumers fault because they want to much in the RV. I believe that comment says it all.

    By Anonymous JW, at March 31, 2007 4:46:00 AM PDT  

  • Our GULFSTREAM CRESCENDO had a handful of problems and we were ignored by Tom Raper RV in Indiana. GULFSTREAM and Best Buy RV in Indiana stood by their warranty and we could not be happier. Take a look at GULFSTREAM if the other manufacturers aren't standing behind their product.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 5:13:00 AM PDT  

  • It's sad that Dennis had to resort to this to get Monaco's attention but I'm not surpirsed. I bought a Monaco 6 moths ago and have been trying to get Monaco to send me an owner's manual for it since day 1. They have always given me the same answer - it's on the way. So even a simple request like mine that is easily fulfilled is ignored by Monaco. They rate an "F" for customer service.

    By Anonymous GB, at March 31, 2007 5:39:00 AM PDT  

  • I agree with the service manager above, Winnebago did make the parts available, but why should you need them for a new coach in the first place? I have a 2003 Itasca Sunflyer that was in and out of service for the first year and is just now working well. And that is due to the excellant work by local dealer, who used to sell Winnebagos but got dropped. Probably because he fought for his customers. Still have my maintenance done ther...

    By Anonymous Peter C Moyer, at March 31, 2007 6:11:00 AM PDT  

  • In 2001 we bought a new Damon Intruder. It got so that just about every day we woke up to a new problem. Only a few of these problems were major (inside dual mounted wrong, generator wired wrong, inverter burned up, severe "wiggle" going down the road) but every one of them came down to quality control. It took 8 trips to the dealer and 2 trips to the factory to finally get it all fixed. Second trip to the factory my husband made such a scene he ended up with 3 vice presidents in the coach trying to make him happy. After that trip the coach ended up a great home on the road.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 6:25:00 AM PDT  

  • We have had 8 motorhomes and three of these were new. Our two was from one of the most reputeable mfg. in the industry. We have had very few problems with the basic coach but the Dometic add ons , the refrigerator and the awnings have had us spending our golden years in customer service lounges all over. Overall we have had over 80 incidents and most were Dometic related. There isn't room to tell you about the absolute anguish that we have experienced. We could not go when we wanted to go or stay when we wanted to stay. One of your comments spoke of the money angle and they are absolutely correct. There was $14,000 built into the cost of my coach for warranty service and the mfg has been reluctant to turn loose of the funds. Makes you wonder where the money goes. If the RV industry just took the time to build the coach correctly up front then the warranty problems would go away. Thanks , Herb Whitfield

    By Blogger Herb (whit), at March 31, 2007 6:40:00 AM PDT  

  • That is interesting to me. I was working with a nurse the other day who was complaining about her new Jayco class C motor home. In the shop all the time ,. if not for RV related problems it is in for Truck problems. (MDT Chevy).. her complaints fresh in my ear caused me to look at this thread. I decided to print it out to show her and then I read the feedback...
    As said by someone else.. as soon as the Japanese find out that there is money to be made in the RV industry producing a quality unit... our US industry is in trouble... I would be the first in line for a
    Toyota RV.. and not like the early ones converted here from one ton Toyota pickups.. although I see many of them still on the road with well over a hundred thousand miles..
    I have read MANY reports of problems with RVs just like ours and I thank the Lord we have not had those problems.. drove out of the dealers lot and moved in the next day.. full time ever since.. and loving it..
    John

    By Blogger John, at March 31, 2007 6:42:00 AM PDT  

  • i have a 2004 Beaver Santiam and last October on our way back to California from Virginia we developed a leak in the deisel fuel tank. I noticed it just as we were getting ready to leave the park in San Antonio. A call to Good Sam's got me in touch with a truck repair garage several hundred miles down the road where I got a temporary patch done on the tank.
    Once I got back to Ca. I contacted Monoco customer service regarding the leaking fuel tank and they agreed to pay 1/2 of the labor charge to pull the tank and all of the repair costs, even though the warranty had expired. I figure this saved me at least $2,000.00 in repair costs that I was sure I was going to have to pay.
    This is one Monoco (Beaver) owner who is very satisfied with the after warranty customer service that he received

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 7:16:00 AM PDT  

  • I can sympathize with all new RV owners. I bought a 2006 Mandalay Presidio in September from DeMartini RV in California and had a number of warranty repairs, 20+ (some very minor). I reside in NJ and had to take the coach to the local RV dealer (Myers RV Lakewood, NJ). They took care of all repairs in a timely fashion even though I did not buy the coach from them. At first I was not too thrilled about the number of defects, but talking to other class A owners and some of the horror stories about getting repairs made, I am very satisfied both with the Presidio and the commitment made to honor the 3 year warranty.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 7:18:00 AM PDT  

  • My wife and I have been considering buying a new Monaco product (Holiday Rambler Neptune) and this article has given us reason to be concerned about this purchase!!
    Thanks for the heads up.
    J.R.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 7:40:00 AM PDT  

  • Many Like to Blame the Manufacturer of the RV, But I have discovered that many RV Dealers are paid a fixed Amount of money for each new unit that they sell to cover warranty repairs.If the Dealer dosn't have to do minor warranty work or can put the customer off. then he has an extra profit. I bought a Brand New 2006 5th Wheel last fall and could not believe the shoddy workmanship and the things that I found wrong with it after delivery. I will say that I got excellent service from the dealer and that the warranty repairs were done in a timley manner.
    M H

    By Blogger Mel, at March 31, 2007 8:16:00 AM PDT  

  • This will continue as long as we purchasers continue to buy the product. Shoddy work is the norm for the manufacutrers; every dealer I have talked to says "you have to expect a list of defects". If we would boycott the manufacturers and refuse to buy their product, things would change. It boggles my mind that the manufacturers would rather pay $95 an hour repair shop labor to fix a problem, than build it right the first time at significantly less manufacturer shop labor. I have always subscribed to the concept of "if you don't have time to do it right the first time, when will you have time to do it over".

    By Anonymous Bill S, at March 31, 2007 8:49:00 AM PDT  

  • The old 1989 Barth with in motion satellite,two Sam's Club 37" Vizio tv's, cruise control,the old Gillig chassis with a 3208T Cat diesel, Mr.Freeze, Costco gumball machine, the Tropical shower outside mount, at 36', 33,000 pounds, and a 150 gallon fuel tank, with a "retired" manufacturer, and available generic parts is appreciated more each day in a world where manufacturer's "accountability" after the sale has become a Vegas crapshoot........I just cancelled my order.......thank you Dennis Abbot.

    By Anonymous dcurl, at March 31, 2007 8:52:00 AM PDT  

  • hi
    we also have a Monaco product--a 2006 Holiday Rambler Neptune. we have had nothing but trouble with it since the day we bought it. the dealer in Mesquite, Texas did not do quality repairs so we had to keep bringing it back. many of the problems were right from the factory. we had to file a Lemon Law claim before they would take it back to Indiana for repairs. well needless to say we are still having trouble with the same problems. in Perry, Ga this year they repaired more things that had been repaired at factory again. said they are pushed so hard and fast there that they do not have time for quality. we are now going forward with the Lemon law. we want out of this coach and all the problems.. sad you have to resort to thatto get the company to notice.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 9:24:00 AM PDT  

  • Bravos for Dennis! We have experienced many problems too and we have often come across others who have experienced worse problems. Actually, we have never found anyone who has a good experience with a dealer.

    However, in our case, we finally were heading in the direction of the Monaco factory service facility near Elkhardt, IN. And I have to say we were treated well there and they did the service we needed. And our coach is 6 years old and no longer manufactured. It is too bad the dealers can't seem to provide this level of service, but they only want to sell RVs - they don't want to fix them.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 10:40:00 AM PDT  

  • "Why can’t RV manufacturers make a consistently good quality product right off the assembly line?"

    Why should they? It's not an item one can return like a CD player or most other items. Most people will eventually just give up the hassle and fork over what it costs to repair the RV. Most people won't have the guts to do what this MH owner did. It is in the RV manufacturer's financial best interests to ignore the problems. Usually they will go away and the mfr will be left with the huge profits that are made on most RVs. It's simple economics. As long as people continue to buy RVs, manufacturer's will continue to build them as cheaply as possible since there are absolutely no quality mandates on the industry. There are safety mandates but they are minimal, at best. Few industries rip off the public to the degree of RV manufacturers. In fact, a VP and general manager of a huge RV dealer said to me once, "They're junk! They're all junk - even the highest priced ones are all junk!"

    Kathy Frazier

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 10:47:00 AM PDT  

  • For many rv owners, purchasing a lemon could effect their financial well being for the rest of their lives. For some, it's recreation. For others it's a way of life. Something they worked hard for all their lives. Some have sold their homes to afford their "dream rv", trading in something that appreciates in value for something that depreciates in value. That's a choice they make to fulfill a dream. The very least rv manufacturers can do is built a quality product and back it with a solid warranty. There's plenty of profit and no need for the greed. How about it manufacturers, do any of you have a conscience. Stand behind your product!

    By Anonymous DaveB, at March 31, 2007 10:49:00 AM PDT  

  • As soon as someone figures out how to bring the manufacturing principles the auto manufacturers had to learn when Toyota and Honda started eating their lunch, then we'll see a quality RV for a reasonable price. Building it right doesn't cost more, it costs less.

    Somebody will figure that out and the industry will change. In the meantime, we get stuck with the garbage we have.

    By Blogger john146, at March 31, 2007 11:41:00 AM PDT  

  • WWW.BEAUDRY-MONACO-STINK.COM.
    We purchased what we were told was a 2006 $620,000.00 Monaco Signature 45' retirement dream, road ready, perfect for our travels,care free, inspected and double-double checked, finest coach made, get-in and go rolling home of excitement, leisure, last coach we ever need to purchase as we entered retirement...ONLY TO FIND MAJOR safety defects and a coach delivered to us by Beaudry that was unusable, could not drive,major defects, 136 line items of problems and a coach incrasingly falling apart as we tried to use it. PLEASE do not find yourself in the situation that we have...it has destroyed our lives, robbed us of retirement, made us sick to our stomach every moment of every day and to the point we now HATE RVing.Larry & Karen Johnson of Brighton, Colorado. (please let us hear of similar/like situations so we the consumer, can hold RV dealers and manufactures accountable for the product they misrepresent and destroy lives. Thanks.)

    By Anonymous Larry Johnson, at March 31, 2007 12:16:00 PM PDT  

  • Dear Blog Author.
    Karen and I are not radical quacks but married 46 years, business owners with four children and 5 grandchildren. Beaudry RV and Monaco have destroyed our lives, wrecking our self-funded retirement to the point of having to abandon our hopes of even partial relaxation and enjoyment of our life's work...Please do your readers and RV'ers know of our delemina in that we are not looking to take "jabs" or overstate actual situations or conditions...this is "real RV life" of today! Thank You. Please contact me as I have nothing to hide nor lie about. kitdsgn@aol.com, 303-654-9911

    By Anonymous Larry Johnson, at March 31, 2007 12:23:00 PM PDT  

  • Thank you for all of the information and specifics. We're headed to an RV show tomorrow and your input makes us smarter potential buyers.

    And people are surprised we like the RV life. Poor them!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 12:52:00 PM PDT  

  • Try a Born Free. They now make a 32' model and their customer service is the best in the business. Like other manufacturers they use the industry standard components but after the sale they go overboard to solve any problems that come up. Visit the owners club website/bulletin board and see for yourself. I own a Born Free and I'd never buy a brand X again.

    By Anonymous Dave Potter, at March 31, 2007 1:49:00 PM PDT  

  • I bought a new 33’-11” (34 feet) 5th wheel made by Dutchmen on January 2007 and it has a roof problem so now a Dutchmen dealer wants to fix the problem but refuse to do the job all because Dutchmen warranty department claims that the trailer is only 29 feet long (get this) because the model listed is “29DRL”. Dutchmen told me that I would have to pay out of my pocket the difference of the little over 30 hours the dealer wants approved from the 29 hours approved to do this repair on a “29-foot” trailer. I climbed on the roof and measured 31 feet from the rear roof joint to the front joint. I emailed Dutchmen telling them that I can’t believe they don’t even know how long their own trailers are unless they have another company building this model. So far I have not heard back from Dutchmen. MJ.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 2:02:00 PM PDT  

  • We have been very blessed with our 2002 Monaco Diplomat that we purchased new from Beaudry in Tucson. It has been an excellent motor home. We did use the Monaco facility at Wildwood, FL in Feb 07 because our ABS/ATC lights would not go out. Monaco replaced a component and our charges were listed as "goodwill" which means we did not have to pay anything. Just wanted to add a good story to the blog.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 2:04:00 PM PDT  

  • Amen to what has been said...we purchased a 2005 Fleetwood Pace Arrow at a show in Ft. Myers Fla in Jan 2005 and KNEW NOTHING ABOUT RVING. Needless to say, we got a BIG education really quickly!!! Our RV was completed on 12/29/04 and they musta been partying big time at the factory that week. We have had more things go wrong, and weird things like the wiring harness on our Allison tranny that took 2 different companies 5 days to troubleshoot and repair. We have spent more time in obscure campground all over the Northeast while awaiting repairs the first year...eek! it was awful! Fleetwood did repair things at no charge to us but there was just way too much wrong to begin with. Quality was NOT job one and I doubt moving things to Mexico will improve it. Our next coach WILL NOT BE A FLEETWOOD! This time, we toured the factory of our potential new rig and saw how they made things and their work ethic, impressive! Good choices come from experience, experience comes from bad choices....live and learn! Now we know....

    By Anonymous Sharyn Selskey, at March 31, 2007 2:39:00 PM PDT  

  • We heard a lot of similar stories before we bought our Allegro Bus. We did our homework. We bought a Tiffin product because they build them right and if there are problems they fix them. If we are across the country they will send the parts immediately. We have had our share of problems. Everyone does. Ours have been mostly minor. When we go to an RV service shop they all tell us they think Tiffin is the best manufacturer to deal with. Bob Tiffin is a legend in the industry. That is why we bought a Bus. Do your homework and do not buy from those who build poor products and then do not stand behind what they sell.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 3:12:00 PM PDT  

  • Full timing in a Jayco product voids the warranty. Not exactly "standing behind thier product"

    "We are all quick to point out a manufacturer that does poorly, but Jayco deserves credit for standing behind their product with a two year warranty and the best customer service and parts people in the business. This RV dealer can lay down and sleep at night because I sell a good product. We have sold other brands and, believe me, there is a difference!"

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 4:02:00 PM PDT  

  • I watched the tatooed Monaco waiting to be parked at the FMCA convention. I immediately shot a photo for all my friends to see on the internet! Hooray for them! I am glad to hear of one person's "success" story with Gulfstream Coach, aka Gulf Stream Coach. I, and many others, have not been as fortunate. Anyone interested in a Gulf Stream (Gulfstream) product should browse the owners' forum at gsowners.com for a more comprehensive view of Gulf Stream (Gulfstream)products and service.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 5:05:00 PM PDT  

  • Our '05 Newmar Kountry Star motorhome had several problems following delivery but all have been covered by warranty and the company is easy to deal with.

    Although we purchased it elsewhere, RV Corral in Eugene, Oregon has treated us as if we had purchased it from them and made the repairs as quickly as possible.

    We would definitely buy another Newmar product and this time from RV Corral.

    We love our RV and RVing.

    By Anonymous R & M, at March 31, 2007 5:22:00 PM PDT  

  • Buy used. Let the first owner deal with it. Really we just bought our first MH a 05' Discovery.Check the records, inspect the coach and pay your money. Just got back from our 3k mile shakedown cruise without problems. Spent my entire career in the construction industry, maybe I'm more realistic than most but these things are houses on wheels. The stresses placed on them traveling down the road are incredible. To expect them to be trouble free is unreasonable. Think about it, how would your 500k house stand up to constant 70mph winds and earth tremors. There are quality control issues but very few could afford the costs to build these things to the standards some of these folks expect.

    By Blogger Hondo, at March 31, 2007 6:06:00 PM PDT  

  • THAT is OUR six week old Tiffin Allegro Bus in the background of the picture at the FMCA rally in Perry GA. We have less than five problems, none major, and all will be taken care of by Tiffin without squabbling. I agree with doing the homework. We are full timers, on our second motorhome and the Tiffin reputation was by far the deciding factor in the purchase in January.
    Paul & Claudia Medlock

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 6:37:00 PM PDT  

  • The Leading experts in Quality Control have stated for many years that the biggest obstecle to Quality in Manufacturing is Management. The bottom line is all they care about, and Quality costs money, and they can't seem to realize that the consumer will not come back to buy again if problems keep occuring, but will go to other manufacturers for their RV needs. I am fortunate to have bought a Newmar in 2004 with a three year warrenty, which is now 1 year. Talk about stepping backwards. I realize that quality costs in the manufactureing process, but pays back dividends in happy return customers. These are just my observations and like opinions, every one has one. tinkercb

    By Anonymous tinkercb, at March 31, 2007 6:47:00 PM PDT  

  • Wow, does this story sound familar. I bought a 2004/05 Four Winds Infinity Class A in May of 2004 in Tuckahoe NY. Has been in shop 75% of the time I have had it. Even took it to Elkhart In. to manufacturer for over a week at my own expense. I was promised everything would be fixed better then new. well about 200 miles out of ElkhartI was sitting on the side of the road trying to get the generator running. Electrical was 1 of the major problems. I live in NC so had to drive it back without generator. When I got back homeI had nothing but lip service from the manufacturer and have had to travel a minimun of 70 miles to the closest shop who would work on it. Well guess where it is now? Thats right in the shop! Almost 3 years later and lord knows how much money out of pocket it still spends more time in the shop then it ever has in my driveway.
    I hope you have better luck then I've had!

    By Anonymous Ladyice01, at March 31, 2007 7:05:00 PM PDT  

  • Wow, does this story sound familar. I bought a 2004/05 Four Winds Infinity Class A in May of 2004 in Tuckahoe NY. Has been in shop 75% of the time I have had it. Even took it to Elkhart In. to manufacturer for over a week at my own expense. I was promised everything would be fixed better then new. well about 200 miles out of ElkhartI was sitting on the side of the road trying to get the generator running. Electrical was 1 of the major problems. I live in NC so had to drive it back without generator. When I got back homeI had nothing but lip service from the manufacturer and have had to travel a minimun of 70 miles to the closest shop who would work on it. Well guess where it is now? Thats right in the shop! Almost 3 years later and lord knows how much money out of pocket it still spends more time in the shop then it ever has in my driveway.
    I hope you have better luck then I've had!

    By Anonymous Ladyice01, at March 31, 2007 7:05:00 PM PDT  

  • We are looking to buy our first motorhome. After reading this blog, I have a much greater appreciation for service. For that I thank you. What manufacturers should we be considering? We will probably buy a used diesel class A vehicle. It sounds like Newmar and Tiffin are at the top of the list. Would you agree? Are there others we should consider? Any suggestions?

    By Anonymous Paul Robinson, at March 31, 2007 7:47:00 PM PDT  

  • I feel for him and he is right but after looking at the pictures... well what do you expect when it is snowing ? Where are you from ? even the $100.000.00 car will have frozen up wipers and mirrors !!! Gee!! yes!! snow on windshield will keep you from seeing your mirrors !!!
    From someone who lives where there is snow...

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 10:02:00 PM PDT  

  • We bought a new 2000 Coachmen Santara which probably was the first one that came off the line and boy, did it show. We took it on one trip and everything went wrong. My husband wrote a letter to the president of the company who personally called us and within a couple of weeks we had a brand new coach, with a few modifications thrown in for our trouble. They didn't run us around trying to fix things-they just gave us a new coach! We have had that coach for 6 years and 50,000 miles. We have had a few minor things since then, but they are always cheerfully and fairly taken care of by their wonderful service centers, especially the one in Mayfield, KY. I am constantly amazed at how kind those guys are and how well they take care of us.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at March 31, 2007 10:38:00 PM PDT  

  • We bought a 2006 Winnebago Adventurer after visiting an RV Show in Timonium, MD. We began having engine problems right from the start. In fact, the engine was "missing" while we were on the test drive. The saleman said that it would take just a simple adjustment to repair. Long story to short: we ended up on the Baltimore Beltway only able to do 15 miles an hour. Eight months later the engine began using oil at the rate of two quarts at each fill up. We documented this and contacted Workhorse chassis directly. Without any hassle whatsoever they replaced our engine with a brand new one at no cost to us.

    Other than that, we have had no major problems with our Winnebago and have just turned over 19,000 miles. We would buy another Winnie in a heartbeat. Wonderful customer service.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 7:31:00 AM PDT  

  • I purchased a Tahoe Fury by Thor. In the almost 2 years I had it I was only able to use it 4 times. It had so many defects and problems. Had to hire an attorney and sue the company to get them to buy it back under the Lemon Law. I now have a Skyline Rampage and could not be happier. 2 year warranty and the factory stands behind it.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 10:24:00 AM PDT  

  • We have an 2003 Allegro Bus, talk about having problems, we sure had our shae. We spent more time in the first two years trying to get our problems resolved

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 1:32:00 PM PDT  

  • We have a 2003 Allegro Bus. Talk about problems, we had more then our share. For the money spent on these rigs, I think there should be better QUALITY CONTROL. I do have to say Mr. Tiffin did take very good care of us and ALL of our problems, and we would buy a motorhome build by Tiffin, again. ROUGHIING IT SMOOTHLY.

    By Anonymous Bob and Di, at April 1, 2007 1:47:00 PM PDT  

  • We bought a Monaco Camelot last year and had 20 + problems with it, some being somwhat major. We elected to take it to the repair facility in Harisburg, OR. While there we were treated great and all items were repaired. As an added bonus with Monaco"s open shop policy you can watch and learn if you so desire. Their lounges are very nice and provide a great number of class'es for learning about all aspects of your coach. We found everone from security personnel to the facility manager to be extermly plesant and helpfull. I know for a fact after owning 4 RV's the service at the factory is far better than any dealer.. Dennis I do feel for the problems that you are having and hope it works out for you.

    By Anonymous Wayne, at April 1, 2007 2:48:00 PM PDT  

  • I just bought a 2008 "Road Warrior" which is Weekend Warriors brand new Class C built on a Kodiak Chassis. Customer service is A++ from them and from Giant RV of Colton. Everything about this Motorhome is first class, they didn't cut any costs anywhere.

    By Anonymous C. Lewis, at April 1, 2007 3:08:00 PM PDT  

  • We have an Insignia from Travel Supreme which we bought at Longview in CT and are thrilled with. There have been some minor problems. All initial problems were handeld without question by the dealer and now that we are on the road full time, Travel Supreme and Spartan Chassis have both been very helpful in directing us to other dealers where we can get work done under warrenty i.e at no cost to us. Life is great! Susan and Reve.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 4:07:00 PM PDT  

  • Gosh, now you have me rethinking our plans. We bought a 1982 Wanderlodge about four years ago for $22,500. Put new tires on it, replaced the hoses and belts, had the bearing repacked, and put a new back end on the generator. That cost about $5,000 but since then we have put between 15,000 and 16,000 miles a year on it with just routine service. I just retired and was considering a new coach, but I think I will just keep our current Motor home. Chuck - Fort Worth TX.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 6:19:00 PM PDT  

  • Anyone that buys any type of motor vehicle, including a motorhome, is protected by state and FEDERAL Lemon laws. The Federal version is usually much stronger than the state, and has a broad scope of coverage. If a problem can not be corrected after (I believe) three attempts, then it is considered a lemon and a refund plus court cost is the normal remedy. Consult an attorney! Good Luck!

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 1, 2007 6:28:00 PM PDT  

  • We have owned an'04 Monaco Knight for about 2 1/2 years now.We had a bedroom slide that leaked even though we brought it to a couple of dealers & factory in Indiana.We finally had it fixed(maybe) in Wildewood,Fl.The service rep told me even though it was out of warranty they fixed it under good will.I reminded him that as far as I was concerned it was fixed under warranty because it had been a problem since brand new.He seemed to ignore my comment .He said that it was now fixed.I certainly hope so as this is our home & I certainly don't want a water leak.

    Charlie & Bonnie

    By Blogger charlie, at April 1, 2007 6:31:00 PM PDT  

  • Seriously...."why" does this industry not respond to it's customers? Why do they believe they are above producing a viable product when paying in excess of $620,000.00 for a coach? Why must "we" resort to blogging? What other industry is so above providing a viable product? Why does not FMCA care? (yes...I've contacted them and they would not allow me to place a "negative" ad.

    By Anonymous Larry, at April 1, 2007 8:32:00 PM PDT  

  • I'll be in Memphis with banners on my "good" coach showing Beaudry RV and Monaco as my least favorite, as I understand others will be doing...who of you will we see their also? I will contact local and national affiliate media groups and take our issues where we will be heard and reckoned with!
    With enough participation we can request our own parking section, and pre-assemble as a caravan.

    By Anonymous Larry, at April 1, 2007 8:40:00 PM PDT  

  • MONACO &$#@!(%^$@#$!! We bought a brand new (Actually ordered it from a dealership so it would be exactually what we wanted)Endeavor 2007. Problems, Problems, Problems!! Absolutely no quality control from the factory. I had a list of problems two pages long. Some are still not corrected. If enough dissatisfied buyers complain maybe they'll start to hurt in the pocketbook!

    Jerry B.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 2, 2007 7:42:00 AM PDT  

  • For the price one should look a
    ALFA SeeYa or Seeya Gold. They also have their problems but you have a lot of money left over to fix them. And in most cases the problems are not that many or serious.

    By Blogger Bob Goble, at April 2, 2007 11:04:00 AM PDT  

  • Every day is Christmas.
    We had a 2001 Winnebago Adventurer that we bought from Beckley's in Frederick, Maryland. True we had some minor issues with it, but Beckley's was excellent at getting them fixed for us. Should we have had any problems with it at all? No more than I had with my builder when he built my house...and the RV was easier to get settled!
    As a result, we went back to Beckley's to buy our 2005 Winnebago Vectra. Again, we've had some problems with it, but they've been responsive, and even took it back to Winnebago's plant in Iowa last Novenber, where we were treated very well.
    Will we buy another Winnebago in the future? probably if they change the color schemes (2007's arent so subtle). But will we buy from Beckley's? You bet!
    Quit your wining, nothing manufactured in the U.S. today is perfect, even hospitals have issues. So you find the least troublesome product, and the most effective service at a Dealership, and that's where you take your business.
    If you don't buy a brand because it's the worst put together, or don't buy from a dealer that doesn't offer satisfactory service, the next time you go to buy one, they probaably won't be around.
    Like the saying goes, "this isn't your father's oldsmobile anymore".
    Get used to it!

    By Anonymous Va Tuna, at April 2, 2007 12:18:00 PM PDT  

  • Hi All,

    As an independent RV service center and a Certified Master RV Tech, I have seen just about every type of coach and defect. When I fix a problem, it's fixed properly and finally, unless the replaced component fails, which is then a component manufacturer problem.

    That said, I think that people contemplating the purchase of a new coach should look at the factory warranty, repair reputation and follow up done by them BEFORE looking at price.

    Tiffin and Newmar are leading the industry (outside of the Prevost converters and Newell Coach) in taking care of their customers complaints. Monaco used to enjoy this reputation, but they have fallen hard from their once lofty perch in theeir customers' eyes. I do a lot of warranty work for both OEMs and they are genuinely interested in keeping their customers satisfied and on the road.

    Just something to think about BEFORE your purcheas!

    By Anonymous Lew, at April 2, 2007 1:56:00 PM PDT  

  • Boy, after reading all the negative I realize how fortunate I am with my 'little' 30' class A Hurricane from Four Winds. Yes, I had some issues when it was new, '04, but was more than pleased with the service I recieved from Four Winds. I would definitely purchase their product again.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 2, 2007 3:02:00 PM PDT  

  • OK, let's hear the rest of the story! Why not get Mr. Abbot's reaction now that Monaco is attempting to take care of the many problems he has had with his coach. We've heard all the bad stuff - now, let's get the rest of the story!! It's called "honest reporting"!

    Lew

    By Blogger Lew and Dottie Anderson, at April 2, 2007 5:27:00 PM PDT  

  • We purchased 2 years ago a 1999 Damon Ultrasport, nice unit but boy does the after sales service issue ring a bell. We purchased from VoyagerRV near Kelowna BC and had so many after sales issues with them that we eventually gave up and just fixed stuff at our own cost. Their attitude was "you should have known that before buying!" I have better after sales service on milk gone bad too quick at the local grocery store than on a $100,000 purchase. John Dale, nelson BC Canada

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 2, 2007 7:02:00 PM PDT  

  • DON'T buy a FLEETWOOD product. After several issues within my first year of ownership I called and asked for the warrenty to be extended no charge. Fleetwood told me they had no record of my rig ever needing service. Someone isn't fessing up here. I have the paperwork, this rig has spent 7 weeks of down time in the dealers service department. I was told that "there would be no need to extend the warranty because Fleetwood undestands the investiment the owner has made and they Fleetwood stand behind their product and you the owner." NOT TRUE!!!! A few months after the warranty expired I found a serious water leak. I called explained the previous conversation I had with customer service- Fleetwood said "your warranty expired it's your problem.Fleetwood would never make such a statement, you could have PURCHASED from your dealer an extended warranty." I gave the time date and name of the person I spoke to the first time. This person said he had no idea who that person might have been because "they don't work for Fleetwood now". MY FIRST AND LAST FLEETWOOD ANYTHING, and same goes for the dealer Paulsbo RV first and last anything from them.
    I'm doing everything I can to get the word out, stay away from FLEETWOOD. I don't want anyone to go through what we have. It's suppose to be fun and relaxing not cause chest pain

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 2, 2007 7:20:00 PM PDT  

  • I cannot wait for the Japanese to come and give some serious competition to the big manufacturers,ala Toyota,Nissan,etc.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 2, 2007 8:21:00 PM PDT  

  • We own a Newmar 2004 Kountry Star diesel pusher 37' in length.
    Even though there were numerous issues, all were repaired at the factory in a timely manner.
    Sadly, we say "all new motorhomes come partially assembled"
    One thing that bothers me though is that the customer is sometimes treated as though they are the problem and not the coach.
    We just went off warrenty and still have one problem that has been addressed several times and is not yet fixed. We complained that the battery drawer would not work properly so that we could check the batteries. It was at the dealership, fixed..but not fixed. It was at the factory and again, the issue was addressed, they said it was fixed...but it was not. Finally here in FL, we went to a Newmar dealership to have it addressed. Newmar extended our warrenty to cover this issue only and guess what...the whole mechanism fell apart in the hands of the employee.
    He called the factory to explain what happened and asked if they should cut out the mechanism and weld in a new one..or should the box be replaced. Well, due to time constraints, we cannot wait here until a new box is sent from the factory,or a new mechanism. The fix was to drill a hole through the front of the box or battery tray and through a part of the frame...and drop a bolt through both. This keeps the box of batteries from banging into the bay door. Now Newmar wants us to have it fixed ASAP. No one wanted to fix it ASAP any of the previous times. All in all, we LOVE our motorhome and are generally pleased with Newmar and their customer service. I feel bad for others though who are experiencing diverse problems. After reading through the blogs, I have to be thankful that we purchased a Newmar and that we have had as few problems as we have had.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 3, 2007 8:47:00 AM PDT  

  • Just a FYI
    We have found that problems are addressed quickly at the rallies.
    We tend to go to the individual manufacturer and address the problem with them..be it Dometic, Fan-tastic Fan, Freightliner, etc.
    Its worked well for us.
    We recently had a situation occur that I want to share. Twice we noticed that two of our large Michelin bus tires lost air after being checked for proper pressure just 30 minutes earlier. The first time it was an inside dual on the passenger side and we were able to drive the one mile to a large tire repair facility. On inspection, there was nothing wrong with the tire but rather it was the valve stem was installed improperly so that the rubber grommet was falling apart and allowed the air to leak out when the tire was in a certain position.
    The stem was replaced with a regular long truck stem and problem solved. Six months later, we checked the pressure of the tires and all was well, but less than thirty minutes later, we made a stop and I noticed that the front driver side tire was low on air. It was down to sixty pounds. I called Coach Net and a truck was dispatched. Again, it was the valve stem grommet that failed. (There is less than 30,000 miles on the coach, its stored inside and the wheels are always covered) To make a long story short, we took the coach to Crawford Tire just east of Orlando off Hwy 50 and had all of the wheels pulled and the valve stems inspected. All of the stems were bad. The grommets had a deep ridge around the top edge and the ridge was breaking away..thus the leakage in certain positions. All of the stems were replaced with regular long truck stems. The inside dual stem now projects approx two inches out through the chrome simulator and there is no need for any extensions. We also got rid of the flexible stem extensions that were put on by the manufacturer. On the outside duals and front tires, the six inch stems were put in a tube benter and reconfigured so that they are easy to access and no extensions are needed.
    I reported this incident to Freightliner and was concerned that it might possibly be a reason for why so many cases of inside dual blowouts occur. We noticed the problem quickly because of monitering devices on the wheels to alert us of pressure loss however many people probably don't check their tires as frequently as recommended and may experience pressure loss and not know it.
    It was not a Freightliner problem really..nor is it a Michelin problem or failure...due to the dominoe effect, it is the failure of the guy who put the valve stems through the rims at the sight of manufacture.
    We are very pleased with Freightliner and their customer care. I reported the problem to them and they compensated us fully for changing out all of the valve stems.
    The FYI is to alert you to a possible problem and its solution.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 3, 2007 9:09:00 AM PDT  

  • Much has been accomplished since arriving at the Perry Convention.

    At the convention, Magnum Energy at Monaco’s request looked at the Inverter which was periodically dropping AC power, sometimes until battery the disconnect switch is thrown, other times briefly causing the Directv receiver to reboot and the microwave clock to need to be set. Also the automatic generator start would sometimes fail to start. Magnum made some temporary setting changes which improved the operation and promised that a software update to correct these problems were already being tested and would be provided as soon as testing was complete. Monaco agreed to reimburse me for the dealer’s invoice to diagnose the inverter problem that I had to pay myself because Monaco tech support said it was not covered under warranty and was a problem with my batteries or that something was drawing too much current on the coach. I am told both of these items will be resolved.

    TracStar Systems replaced a failed LNB and a failing servo motor.

    Monaco provided updated sensors for the fresh water, grey water and black water tanks. The sensors installed in my coach were black in color. New grey colored sensors that will maintain calibration with the Aladin computer were provided. I installed and calibrated the system. Time will tell if this solves the problem.

    I received a check for reimbursement for a temporary roadside service repair made when a misrouted coolant hose caused the loss of engine coolant.

    I received and installed a replacement backup camera.

    I have been told Monaco will authorize repair of the dash air conditioner as a chassis warranty repair.

    I will post further updates.

    Dennis Abbott

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 4, 2007 5:31:00 AM PDT  

  • We have a 2004 Challenger 5th wheel and are quite satisfied with Keystone. The problem we have had is with extremely poor quality service by Beaudry RV in Mesa, AZ. While we were moving from our old 5th wheel to this one it had a tire go flat at the dealership. It was only with the help of my salesman I was able to get it repaired, the holding tank valves were left open with the cap on! Drinking water filter was not installed, and when returned for installation they ran the screws through the cabinet. A warranty repair was performed on a slide out roof, but the technicians air tool hose put a hole on the edge that was not corrected by them. When the replace a defective anti-siphon valve for the black tank rinser, screws in the plumbing hanger protruded through the floor. The 50amp power cord was damaged and stowed back in the rig. We notified them the first night out, but it took several weeks for them to supply us with a new one.
    I wrote a total of three different letters and photos, with copies to Beaudry RV Hdqtrs, Tucson, and Beaudry Mesa, General Manager and Service Manager. I am still waiting for a reply from Beaudry, 3 years and holding. Copies were sent to Keystone, I received replies from them.
    My recommendation - Consider my experience before you shop Beaudry.

    By Anonymous toma2z@netzero.com, at April 5, 2007 9:49:00 PM PDT  

  • We have a 2007 TourMaster by Gulfstream, and had to replace the air cleaner after 1000 miles, and both front tires after 9000 miles. The tires were both showing the steel in the rubber. Gulfstream said it was an alignment problem and not their responsibility. We spent $2500.00 in Elkhart Indiana buying new tires and trying to find out what was causing the coach to pull to the right, wear out tires, and what was banging underneath. After writing a very long letter to the CEO of TourMaster complaining about their "customer no-service" we were sent to the Freightliner dealer in Tolleson AZ. They quickly found that the problem was that the rear axle was not torqued and the axle was moving back and forth. We finally got reimbursed about $1800 of our $2500 investment, but not until 6 months after we had to spend it! We are enroute now to our dealer to get other Gulfstream issues addressed, but the safety issues were with the Freightliner chassis. But as we said in our letter, we didn't buy a Freightliner chassis and it arrived with a TourMaster coach on it. We bought a TourMaster. Why do the manufacturers build such beautiful coaches, and then not stand behind their product?

    By Anonymous Denny and Mary, at April 7, 2007 6:37:00 AM PDT  

  • Before buying an RV, I subscribed to several RV magazines for about 5 years. I was appalled that there were regular monthly columns devoted to getting defects corrected for RV owners. This just about turned me off from buying an RV. I ended up getting a used RV and have been very happy with it. Besides, an older RV has many more windows than the current RVs.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 7, 2007 8:00:00 AM PDT  

  • Have any owners of the 2002 monaco navigator been having problems with the side body panels cracking?

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 7, 2007 10:51:00 PM PDT  

  • I did not read all the comments, bur read enough to make a few comments. I used to be an RV salesman (and car salesman) and mostly sold used units. I loved talking with customers in great detail about the unit they were considering. We did carry one major line of RVs, the Sunline towable trailer; the best I have ever seen. One thing I like about used RVs is that the kinks are already worked out and the unit is typically in excellent condition with all systems working. The skin may not shine like new (and a good detailer can fix that most of the time), but everything works, especially if the unit has over 20,000 miles. That is because the previous owner(s) has had the unit fixed while in warranty. Why spend a fortune on new with problems when one can get used with no, or very minor, problems. But a word of caution; it depends on the dealer and how well they check out the unit before they put it up for sale, and more importantly how well the potential buyer spends his or her time inspecting the unit and questioning the dealer about absolutely everything. An honest dealer will spend time with you and cover everything. A pushy salesman or manager should be avoided at all costs. A salesman or manager that ignores you should also be avoided and you should then visit another dealer in great haste. My wife and I purchased a 10 year old motorhome in 2004 that had 32,000 miles on it. The unit had absolutely no problems; everything worked like new. The skin was slightly faded, and the windshield was a little pitted, and there were touches of rust here and there on the bottom that could be touched up with no problem, and there was one stain on the carpet that I removed with a good shampoo. Buy used. Why throw away your good hard earned money for something that will depreciate 20%-50% when you sign on the dotted line. Shop carefully and intelligently. The same applies with purchasing a car or truck or SUV. Used is normally better use of your money if you do your research. You also have more bargaining power with a used unit.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at April 11, 2007 5:04:00 PM PDT  

  • "Why can’t RV manufacturers make a consistently good quality product right off the assembly line?"

    They can. Lazy Daze does; so do Born Free and Prevost. If you want to know who else does, get the RV Consumer group ratings CD and look for five-star ratings. You won't find many, but there are some. Anyone who shops for an RV without first checking the RVCG ratings is likely to be sold shoddy goods, which are all too common in this industry.

    By Anonymous Anonymous, at November 12, 2007 6:18:00 PM PST  

  • We purchased a new 2005 Monaco Dynasty in June 2006. It has spent its entire life (275 days to date) at the Dealer or Monaco Warranty Service Center. One work repair order listed 113 items and most of those are still unresolved. Our tag axles have NEVER worked properly. Our suspension has always been a constant problem. The HWH (leveling) module has been replaced 4 times, only to find out that the one installed at the factory was a module for a non tag axle coach. Our front tires have severe cupping due to undue stress and excessive wear from the tag axle not working properly. We know two Monaco owners that have the exact same issue. We also met two owners that had all tires replaced by Monaco, but signed a conf. agreement and are unable to disclose info. We are serioulsly considering having our coach painted to look like a LEMON and attending all RV rallies and the 2008 Monaco stockholders meeting.
    If you see a 40 foot lemon going down the highway, chances are it is the Parrot! Unfortunatley, like the ad on TV, the camping in us has got up and gone.

    By Blogger Parrot, at March 8, 2008 12:36:00 PM PST  

  • When I purchased my 2007 Four Winds Dutchmen Super C on the Kodiak chassis, I wasn't concerned about "quality." I paid for having a safe chassis and a driveable coach. Boy, was I wrong!! A few weeks after my purchase, I discovered it leaned towards the driver's side 4 inches. After having a four corner weighin performed, I found that the coach was almost 1,500 lbs heavier on the driver's side.

    After sending several letters during the past 9 months to Thor Industries, I still have not received a reply. I have a blog on www.rvfactor.blogspot.com that describes the problem.

    Meanwhile, I have discovered several other safety/quality issues which are also posted.

    Dennis

    By Anonymous Dennis Myhre, at April 12, 2008 9:31:00 AM PDT  

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