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Comments for The RV road trip is near death

  • Hi Chuck, I read your column every week. I hope you continue your efforts to improve RV’s. You tend to stay in developed places, so this article reflects that….lack of spaces. I tend to BD. We have a 2012 35′ MH. I would like to upgrade, but there are no new products out there (affordable) that are set up for that. Please consider researching and writing about this issue.

  • I like quiet, natural places. You’re telling me I’m fine. Those who want to go where everybody else goes will have a price to pay That I would never sacrifice. I have a price to pay that most of them would not want to give. That is, I need to do a little research and be self contained. I also “give up” things I don’t have, such as fireplaces. I’m good with that, but I imagine some of the campground folks will find another way to travel or something else to do.

  • I gave up on the RV life style about a year ago for many of the same reasons you write about in your article. I understand the call of the open road and the freedom to park where you will but while everyone says the RV life style is a more economic way to travel and perhaps it is for those who live in their RV, I don’t see it that way. For the average cost of a Motorhome and all of the things you need to outfit it, plus insurance and fuel, I can easily spend 500 days on the road spending $300.00 a day. I am 70 years old and suspect I will be driving from motel room to motel room on my trips across the US.

  • We have been “full-timing” since we purchased our first RV in 2010 and sold our house. We have watched available RV spots slowly dry up each year when we attempt to travel around because of the reservation system that is now in place allowing folks to reserve a spot well in advance and many are cancelled at the last minute which makes the situation even worse. So, in short, we don’t know how much longer we will be able to “wander aimlessly” around this beautiful country, thank goodness we saw the major national parks during our first outings.

  • We are “tourist RVrs”…traveling to see the sights. We don’t know exactly where we’ll end up each day and so don’t like to reserve a spot until early afternoon of the day. We still get by but can see the writing on the wall of this becoming more and more difficult. We are getting a new RV and thought seriously about getting a class B so we could more easily stealth camp as needed but too used to a 28′ class C style and have stayed with that.

  • I have been saying for years the number of camp sites is far below the number required. Few new sites being built while some are being lost to development, acts of nature, and more. For this very reason we will not be buying another 5er. We do NOT even use it June, July, and August already. We make Jan – Mar reservations a year ahead. At some point it will no linger be worth the hassle and that point may come sooner than thought, sadly.

    • This is us also – only we just got started and bought our first RV (Class A) less than a year ago. We left 40yrs of boating to start RV’g. We spent months researching brands, etc. but I can’t believe we didn’t research the most important component of RV’g — campgrounds! Knowing what I know now we never would’ve gotten into RV’g. However, now that we have made an investment we will make the best of it but we also won’t be camping between June-Aug. We will wait until school starts. We have already started making reservations for Jan 2018. I don’t like paying $150/night for resorts but I’m tired of being on top of each other. Not so sure this is what I consider retirement.

  • I see in the future the “RV BUBBLE” bursting as more and more people find it is not what they were led to believe by the RV industry. Lack of and over crowded campgrounds will eventually take it’s toll on the RV industry. Between that and the lack of quality, it is a boom that is destined to bust.

  • Fortunately, my wife and I traveled the country and to Alaska and back without ever making a reservation. That was nearly a decade ago. In recent years we camp more locally in Florida. Reservations are a must in winter though there are a few places that always have space during the week. So now we camp Monday thru Thursday in some very nice places. I will not disclose where. We have been thinking of making another trip west this summer. We have seen most of the popular NPs and tourist attractions so we don’t care if we can’t get in there. We love BLM and NF camping. No electric, no water, no internet or phone, OK! I know that keeps the mobs away. The only mobs we see is a herd of elk passing near our campsite or maybe a flock of turkeys or some coyotes. I guess we are good to go.

  • This is one of the main reasons our first, and likely only, RV is a Class B motorhome. 21′ with no slides and the width of a full size truck allows us to have all the basics we need and still park almost anywhere. We’re travellers though. Have absolutely no desire for the weeks or months long “camping” experience at one place. Our van is essentially a mobile hotel room. If our overnight is in a scenic place, so much the better. If not, I don’t care. We see the scenic places during our travels during the daytime.

  • My wife and I have a different way at looking at these things. We pick where we want to go and the go to “Volunteer,gov” and find a place near where we want to go and then volunteer to help them with their needs. We always negotiate the requirements as to not be doing things we don’t like and usually find the places to be very satisfactory. I realize that some would object to doing this but I’m to be 74 this month and there’s a lot of places that we want to see and by putting a “little” into it we get to go where we want and see what we want and have fun.

    • Tom, would you mind sending me some info on the volunteering, I’m 76 and we still like to travel and that sounds fun and interesting.
      Jim

      • Hi, Jim,
        In case Tom doesn’t see your question, here is a link to the website he mentioned: https://www.volunteer.gov/ You can go onto that page and search for volunteer positions by state, interests, agency, etc. Sounds like a terrific idea! Good luck. —Diane at RVtravel.com

  • Camping spaces are at a premium, time premium for sure, long time lead for reservations.
    I see opportunity where others are touting doom and gloom.
    Anyone interested in building/buying a campround, big market there for sure.
    With our population going up and the demand going up for spaces someone will form another KOA or similar and fill the need.
    Also independent folks can build and finance campgrounds.
    Were I a few decades younger I would have an interest in same.
    We could also push the current administration to expand the National Park Campgrounds since we have more taxpayers now than 100 years ago.
    Just thinking!

    • I dont know if we have more tax payers.,We certainly have more freeloaders,My concern is safety on the road anymore.Especially the south west with who knows what kind of people crossing the border.I carry a weapon in my state (with a permit) of course but laws are different in other states. Maybe I am the only worry wort LOL.

  • Chuck,
    Sounds like your complaints revolve around RV parks, whether you’re talking about rude neighbors, high prices, and or lack of spaces.

    Bite the bullet, don’t put up with those problems, learn to research and find boondocking spots that are free, no other people, star filled skies………did I say they were free? The average RV site is about $35/night x 30= ~$1000/month. That’s half the price of a quality generator!!

    You say you like the security of RV parks; got to tell you, I feel less secure in them than I do boondocking…..and then there’s the high cost of that table, fire ring and electricity that I can generate or pull from the sun….

    Yes, about every three weeks, we use an RV park to rinse and dump our tanks, run our washer/dryer and fill up with water….we look for cheap and can usually find a park for around $20…nor frills, we don’t care about frills there.

    If you truly want to get away from it all, hear quiet, see no one, observe the stars, be able to meditate without interruption, commune with nature; perhaps you should not continue doing what doesn’t work, that’s crazy, try a new and different approach, try adventure for a change.

    You’re welcome to tag along, anytime.

    • Robbie, First , I’ve never said anything about “security” being part of my reason to stay in RV parks. We stay in them because I need to be near other people and civilization (not big cities, however) to see and observe what I write about. Many people these days are combining RVing with their work.

      I simply cannot go camp for weeks on end in the middle of nowhere (where the best boondocking spots may be), and just sit there and still be productive, which in my case involves writing about what I see, do and observe. If I were a nature writer, it would be a different story. In a couple of days I plan to stop at a BLM campground that is about a mile off the main highway, right on the way back to Seattle. There are no hookups, and I suspect the sky will be ablaze with stars. We’ll have a campfire. So. . . I still do get away from the crowds at times, but I simply cannot boondock most of the time and still do my work. So what has happened is that I am now seeing how much harder it is today in crowded RV parks than it was, say 10 or 15 years ago, when there was still more space because the parks weren’t jammed. I’ll continue to write about this.

      • I don’t believe Chuck is unhappy. He is providing a valuable source of information every week, with personal insights that are true and accurate. His readers have come to expect and enjoy his honesty. The weekly analysis is refreshing and informative. It’s not Chuck being “negative”, he is simply pointing out some truths about the industry and lifestyle. It is in fact true, campground vacancies are hard to find, many parks are deferring maintenance, the one can no longer just ‘wing it’ like in the old days.

  • Hi Chuck,
    Having known you back in the 80’s, I can vouch for your RV’ing history. I especially agree with the fact that there are few who have been on the road so consistently. We’ve been full timing a little over two years now and love it, but there are challenges. We bought a lot in an RV park in Arizona, which assures us a home base, but we can venture out from here and rent it out when we’re gone. I encourage all your readers to support the work your doing on their behalf. Glad to hear about the book and look forward to reading it!

    • Thanks, John. Yes, much has changed since we lived in the same town. I think what you are doing, establishing a home base for an RV will become much more popular in the future. But that is not what many of us wanted when we began RVing. The motto was, and the industry is still promoting it, is “go where you want when you want.” That’s just not true anymore.

  • I remember in the early ’50s camping in Rocky Mountain Park with my parents and grandfather. Parents stayed under a tarp on one cot. Park Ranger came by and was worried about them since it was suppose to get down near 32 that night. Bear poked its head in one end and dad putting on pants climbed out the other end. Grandfather and I spent the night in the car. So much more fun and curtious back then when tent camping. People got up when it turned daylight and got QUIET when it got dark. Visited so many of the parks back then when there was elbow room.

  • I just finished reading your April 1 post on campground and RV park crowding. No April Fools joke, for sure! My wife and I have been RVing for 26 years. No full timing, but many 4-5 month long trips, coast to coast. We starled out by using our RV (a VW Westfalia campervan) to “camp”. Over those years we gradually clhanged to using our rigs as “Mobile Homes”, currently with a 31 ft travel trailer to provide creature comforts as we travel from A to B.. After retirement almost 20 years ago, we travelled almost exclusively in the off seasons, never summer. All those years we rarely made advance reservations. I just finished planning a trip to Texas (from WA state) and made reservations for all but one night! As you say, RVing has changed! On this forthcoming trip, I will be checking to see if I really needed to do so.

    • We too have RV’ed for many years and have found the introduction of slideouts have really contributed to the lack of space in campgrounds. The camp site remains the same size, but now there is a slideout intruding into your space from both sides. We have pretty much given up on using our unit because it isn’t much fun anymore.

  • Good morning Chuck,
    Rving is like a lot of other things in life….you have to prioritize and compromise. Seriously. What do you have to have and what would be nice to have and what do you want to pay for that in time and money. Really tedious stuff. In fact, work. Once you hammer out your “mission ” statement . You can develop your OST’s ( objectives, strategies, tactics)
    Write them down and when you are not in a happy place , review your position relative to your mission statement and OST’s and see where you have veered. You should spend at least as much time on YOU , INC. as you would spend on a paying job.
    Example of practical application: you have an objective of going to Hershey, Pa. again? What are you trying to accomplish? How would you like it to be different then last time? That’s not until September so you have time to impact that event now. If it is more important for you to be spontaneous than you have to accept the results of that. Maybe a real slow trip would allow you to spend the day slowly meandering only 100 miles a day and if you get into camp early great and if you get into camp late great but regardless you will have the site you reserved and have seen everything you want. Remember you will always be on plan B anyways. Regards

  • Methinks the ability to be totally self-contained (solar or wind powered) may be becoming more important as time passes. I wonder if global warming will eliminate the off-season of March and April. Too warm to be only for the hardy. RGV movers and shakers have been talking about lower ocupancy rates recently. Curious.

  • At one time I seriously contemplated selling everything and setting off in a small condo-sized rv, to live fulltime. Requires real space, and nowadays planning considerably far ahead. Plus, I really like Change/moving about and find the packing up/hitching/driving a large vehicle thing to be so tedious. So, someday, when the cats have gone to kitty heaven, we’d like to get a simple small camping van and take off on a long road trip. When unable to find a boondocking site or campground, we’ll simply park it at the side of the road.

    As for the rest of modern RV problems, I think fulltiming in a large rv will become a housing alternative for many young people out of necessity. That’s pretty much going to fill up available space in rv parks. Hopefully the demand will result in more park availability for those folks. But I don’t want to be one of them.

  • Crowded RV parks, mostly. Difficult to get reservations; Yes, for Fri and Sat, but much easier for the rest of the week. Example; we traveled from our home in N. California thru Idaho, Montana, Canadian Rockies, B.C, including Vancouver Island, Wa. and Or. last summer, starting June 15 and arriving home the middle of November. We traveled in our beautiful 2005 Beaver 40′ motorhome. We never once boondocked or stayed overnight at a Walmart. We made reservations for Banff, Lake Louise, and Jasper National Parks in May. We were in Banff NP for Canada Day holiday, the busiest day of the year. We actually stayed another 4 days in Banff as someone else left their site early. Crowded? Yes. Could we get reservations one to two weeks out? Yes. Is it all gloom and doom? NO! BTW, the Canadian Rockies should be on everyone’s list of must do trips-Awesome!

  • I would be perfectly happy to boondock nearly all the time. My wife, however, not so much. I suspect full-time RV life, when we get to that point, will be a struggle for us. Perhaps your piece about the overcrowding of RV parks will convince her to look at my idea for more boondocking a bit more favorably.

  • Another difference we see is more and more people – maybe millenials, but not all, are using RVs as permanent housing. Many RV parks are nearly full of long term residents, some of them construction workers and others who may be in an area for a few moths to a year or two. We also see that in some military campgrounds, with active duty personnel living in their RVs and banking the remainder of their housing allowance. In many places that is against the rules or against the zoning code, but enforcement is lacking or unpopular.

  • Thoughtful article Chuck. Has motivated me to contribute, again. My parents converted an old school bus into a camper in the early 60’s (they were much handier than I am) and our family travelled all over the US and Mexico. They went on to own several rv’s. Yes, a lot has changed.
    Now that I am fully retired I’m picking up a new fiberglass travel trailer made by a Canadian company that keenly focuses on quality- Escape. So I look forward to your ratings endeavor.
    For some folks bigger is not always better. This will be my third rv, I’m downsizing from Winnebago MB Sprinter, which was nice, but just a lot to take care of. While much has changed, your newsletter, efforts focusing ing on quality, and giving voice to important issues others aren’t, will help keep and nurture what’s good about RVing that draws many of us to it. Keep up the good work.

  • Hi Chuck, Great article, but unfortunately too true!. We have been RVing for almost 30 years; truck camper, 25 ft Class C, 31 ft Class C. Always towed our Jeep. Now want to downsize and stop towing so looking at Class B rigs. We understand it will be a “step down” in living, but should be less expensive to travel. Wife arises early & I stay up late at night. We really would like a rig with two separate areas so we may settle for a smaller Class C. Considered not having a coach, bu we are not quite ready to “pack it in.”

    • Doug, My wife and I just purchased a Pleasure Way Plateau FL as it has two living areas and I am the early to bed and early to rise one. It works out great for us and we don’t want anything larger as we didn’t buy it to sit around but to go places and do things!

  • In the Texas / Louisiana area which we spend a large amount of time, reservations are required for “Resort” type areas in season or weekends.
    Since we never stay in these swimming pool / Casino / manicured Park settings which are becoming frighteningly expensive – we seldom need to reserve space unless meeting others for a group type getaway.
    State Parks, small local campground & lake campgrounds where you can fish with a small boat are our preferred stops generally a week at a time or longer & we seldom camp during the summer (June thru August) when the kids are out of school.

  • I have RV’d for 27 years, full-timing for the last 14 of them. I have not averaged even one night per year at a pay campground, but I have camped in beautiful places. Most of the time I’ve had access to cell phone and Internet services. It CAN be done.! Be adventurous! Get solar panels and hit the road. Look for dirt roads on public land. BTW, I’m a 75-yr-old woman, traveling alone.

  • Chuck one issue you fail to address is the lack of respect and common courtesy of the general public. Why? It used to be if a child misbehaved you could give them a good slap on the ass. Try that nowadays and you might find yourself behind bars!
    Kids lack respect for authority, their elders and their fellow man and they grow up to be the same way as adults. That’s one reason road rage is so prevalent. You never heard about that in my younger days [I’m 65].
    It will be about three years before I get my first RV. If things keep going like they are now I just might drop the RV thing altogether!

  • You seem so unhappy Chuck. Perhaps it’s time to sell the motor home and keep your office open in Washington. You appear bitter at best about the RV lifestyle. I believe you traveled extensively before full-timing, so what did you think was going to change? You should be blessed to be able to live wherever and whenever you want with the woman you love in a new motor home. How cool is that? I’ve been full timing for 12 years and have been blessed every second of it. I’ve even been invited to a Cummins employee picnic and made awesome friends while “off line” waiting for a repair. That’s part of the adventure. For me that beats sitting at home all day waiting for the cable guy! I’m so sad for all the folks who are missing out on the great adventures that await RVers if you’re willing to look beyond the immediate situation. Go back to writing about travel adventures instead of the industry. It won’t change, but you can. Enjoy life!

    • Mike, I am not sad or bitter at all, in fact I’m as happy as I’ve been in my life. My essays and commentaries of late simply reflect my thoughts about what many others are saying, that RVing has changed. I am also trying my best to explain why it has changed and what that means to us who still travel with RVs. All the things you say about the joys of RVing are true. But with a half million new RVs on the road every year, many RVers are finding it very challenging to find a campsite and when they do, their RV is squeezed next to their neighbors like sardines in a can. And, with so many new RVs rolling off the lines with significant quality issues, many RVers are dealing more with repair shops than campgrounds. You do not read my mail and understand the scope of both these issues.

  • Hi, Chuck. Just want to offer our support & encouragement. We surely appreciate your perspective & totally relate to this & most all your articles & observations. We’ve certainly experienced the crowding you talk about & we agree it’s a very different experience today versus even 10 years ago. The new reality does require a reset of expectations & honing of planning skills that we might have thought could be left behind along with the cranky boss & the overstuffed in-box. That said, since retiring a year & a half ago, we feel extremely fortunate in our full-timing lifestyle. With lots of research & homework (which is how we discovered YOU, & month+ reservations made well in advance (9 months to 2 years out) we’ve loved just about every park & site we’ve temporarily called home, from Colorado Springs to the Great Salt Lake ; from Wilsonville & McMinnville, OR & to Bothel, WA and all over the beautiful Olympic Peninsula – & now on the Oregon Coast – oh, it’s just been heavenly! We look forward to more of your intelligently articulated insights, Chuck, & we’ll be watching for your book!

  • Exactly what you describe is what drove my wife and I to Vanabode instead of using a typical RV. It just makes more sense. We almost NEVER check into a campground, and spend 5-7 months straight on the road.

  • Thanks for the article. I have only been RVing for 4 years and I have noticed the crowds. I do not mind it as long as people are respectable. Kids are kids, especially the young ones but someone commented on the rudeness. They learn it somewhere. I like my glamping conveniences. Each person will find there meaning of RVing and I think it will open up. There are many that jump in not knowing and then not liking what they find.

  • Chuck is rare — a blogger who pulls no punches and will give you the bad along with the good and everything in between. Since it is so rare, people who are used to infomercials and press releases masquerading as blogs aren’t used to such candor and it makes them uncomfortable, so they lash out at the messenger. Whether you are a full timer OR weekender or a once-a-year camper, you know that like everything else good, it also has its downside. People who don’t camp almost never read about the challenges, so we need people like Chuck and his team to educate them! On a smaller scale, I do the same. If someone in the office says they want to buy their first RV, I ask them things like, “Where are you going to store it? How often are you going to use it? What would you tow it with? Do you know you have to reserve way ahead for most campgrounds? Do you know how much campsites cost?” The average camping virgin is clueless because all they know is it was fun as a kid. Many think campsites or free or $5, which is as laughable as a spring training baseball game that costs $20. They have this idealized fantasy of what camping is, and although I love our “Marriott on wheels,” I am quick to school them on the reality. How often have you heard someone say, starry eyed, “when I retire I want to buy an Rv and travel the country”? I don’t want a friend spend 5 or 6 figures on a new motor home only to give it back to Camping World for half of what they paid a year later, barely used. Marcus Lemonis can afford that, but most of us can’t. We have met amazing people at campgrounds and we’ve learned a lot of things. We’ve also met people we would be happy to never see one again, but that’s one of the beauties of camping: you can love them and leave them. I don’t want a sanitized camping fairy tale–that’s what the fiction section is for. I want articles about the good, the bad, the ugly and the just plain weird. It’s the totality of the experience that makes camping (and life) interesting for me. As I write this, I am looking out the window of our RV camped at a Corps of Engineers park in Florida. When we checked in, there was a truck and trailered boat in our site, a first for us.

  • Its not just the campgrounds: hotels and motels are filling up too. Just five years ago it was possible to walk in and get your choice of several rooms. Now it is necessary to reserve several several weeks in advance.
    As Chuck observed, in the more popular areas, there no longer is a “Off-Season” or even a “Shoulder Season”; its either the “Crowded Season” or the “Insanely Crowded Season”
    It is largely the boomers who are to blame. (I’m one too.) Understandably, everyone wants to get some enjoyment out of life before they get too old. A friend in that National Park Service tells me the crowds will peak in the early 2020s, and be lower again by around 2030. But by then I’ll be either too old to travel, or passed on.
    I can fondly remember being in places boondocking where we could safely say we were the only humans within miles, in the late 70s and early 80s. (The countryside outside of Moab, Utah would be an example.) Now many of these exact same places are crowded with dozens of people. Even a lot of places that used to be quaint little towns are now crowded with tourists. Its difficult to have any sort of a unique personal experience any more. And we’ve lost a lot of the personal freedom that came with having open space.
    Oh well, Paradise lost.
    Chuck, I appreciate your telling the situation the way it really is. You’re keeping to higher journalistic standards. Too many other blogs are just “Happy Talk”; which is a disservice to the public, which should have a right to know what is really happening.

  • I thought we were the only ones watching RV travel go to the dogs.We have traveled in RVs over 40 years including 6 years full time in 30 ft TT with no slides in the late ’90s. we now have a new trailer set up in a lovely park 100 miles from our home so have the best of both worlds but miss the going. The highways are not fun anymore, used to enjoy the ride to get to somewhere but now is too nervewracking.We thank our lucky stars that we got to see so much and never had a wreck and only broke down once in Custer State Park in South Dakota. So so true about most people having no respect for others anymore.

    • Whew! At first I thought you were referring to RVtravel.com going to the dogs, Sue. 😯 Thanks for your comments. Have a great day. 😀 —Diane at RVtravel.com

  • Hi Chuck,
    I met you in a little state camp ground off the Colorado River this past January. (With our Blue heeled Diego) We both were commenting we were lucky to just drive in and find a spot. We are “full time”, Snowbirds in a truck camper and headed back to Alaska now. Yes, we have learned we need to plan a little to camp, but what the heck. It’s worth it! We are “living the dream.” Thanks for all your great advice on this site.

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